Irongeek

Infragard

31 posts in this topic

Does anyone here have any dealing with Infragard?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infragard

I was thinking of joining a local chapter, and the only sources of bad information on them I could find were from wingnuts.

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I should have said moonbats instead of wingnuts.

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IT's interesting .. I joined the local chapter here in around 2006 just for informational purposes. It's a good way to keep an eye on little brother to see what the GOV is up to in your area. However it got boring and I got tired of all the email/spam so I dumped it.

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I thought about opening a chapter of it in my area, or using some of their presentations for small business briefings. They seem alright, although the usefulness of FISMA is more questionable.

EDIT: Nevermind. I'm mixing this up with another organization, part of NIST, that does security training & advice for small businesses. My bad. FISMA comment still stands though. ;)

Edited by army_of_one
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I thought about opening a chapter of it in my area, or using some of their presentations for small business briefings. They seem alright, although the usefulness of FISMA is more questionable.

EDIT: Nevermind. I'm mixing this up with another organization, part of NIST, that does security training & advice for small businesses. My bad. FISMA comment still stands though. ;)

Well I hope they hooked you up with the guns at least :).

http://www.infowars.com/infragard-the-fbis...d-shock-troops/

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The whole “shoot to kill” article was probably some member intoxicated at a bar that likely bumped into a reporter or it’s just some sensational new reporter clamoring for attention. One media report out of several hundred should NOT constitute facts. The fact that one person believes that he has the right to 'shoot to kill' is an outright LIE, and infragard has even put out an official press release to address this.

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Are yes, the "progressive" article. Those are the moonbats I mention earlier.

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Ah, irongeek I wasn't sure if you were referring to that article or wikipedia in general. Seriously I want to cry every time I get professional report by a graduate student or corporate executive that actively references Wikipedia. I was at a well known library the other day, and loved the fact that I could pick up a book from the early 1900's - yet the sad fact was the entire library was on the computers. :huh: Sorry I just do not get it, when did a library turn into a cyber cafe and are we training the next generation of student's to believe everything they read online or in newspapers?

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Um, civilian spies and snitches?

The only source of bad information about them is their own existence.

And wait a sec, the Progressive are "moonbats" because they believe in civil rights and oppose violent atrocities? Wow, some people have very "interesting" outlooks. The Progressive is the left, Alex Jones is the right.

Edited by decoder
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Are yes, the "progressive" article. Those are the moonbats I mention earlier.

To quote the article itself:

“The interests of InfraGard must be protected whenever presented to non-InfraGard members,” the website states. “During interviews with members of the press, controlling the image of InfraGard being presented can be difficult. Proper preparation for the interview will minimize the risk of embarrassment. . . . The InfraGard leadership and the local FBI representative should review the submitted questions, agree on the predilection of the answers, and identify the appropriate interviewee. . . . Tailor answers to the expected audience. . . . Questions concerning sensitive information should be avoided.”

Is this happening in this thread? Hmm.

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Um, civilian spies and snitches?

The only source of bad information about them is their own existence.

And wait a sec, the Progressive are "moonbats" because they believe in civil rights and oppose violent atrocities? Wow, some people have very "interesting" outlooks. The Progressive is the left, Alex Jones is the right.

True, but still should not give me the right to shoot somebody in the face at a 2600 meeting for touching my laptop; because I'm a carded member of Infragard, and I have proprietary information on the machine.

Edited by Johnny Haxor
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"Moonbats" as in jumping the gun and being paranoid freaks about things that don't fall in line with their political world view. :) If only I really did get a license to shoot to kill without prosecution. That would me awesome. :)

That said, there may be some snitch types in the org, but it may also be a good source of info. Besides, Obama is in charge now so the fed would never abuse their powers right? :)

Bottom line: I'm checking out the group for myself.

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"Moonbats" as in jumping the gun and being paranoid freaks about things that don't fall in line with their political world view. :) If only I really did get a license to shoot to kill without prosecution. That would me awesome. :)

That said, there may be some snitch types in the org, but it may also be a good source of info. Besides, Obama is in charge now so the fed would never abuse their powers right? :)

Bottom line: I'm checking out the group for myself.

http://www.exposedpublications.us/video/rtt.html

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"Moonbats" as in jumping the gun and being paranoid freaks about things that don't fall in line with their political world view. :) If only I really did get a license to shoot to kill without prosecution. That would me awesome. :)

That said, there may be some snitch types in the org, but it may also be a good source of info. Besides, Obama is in charge now so the fed would never abuse their powers right? :)

Bottom line: I'm checking out the group for myself.

The first 5 words on their website:

InfraGard is an information sharing...

Done. Snitches.

If they did have shoot to kill authority in the event of martial law, it would make sense considering that most normal people would want to kill civilian informants, and rightfully so.

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I went to an Infragard event a few years back in Ft Lauderdale (I took some pictures, I will see if I can find them). Infragard was simply a government entity (part of the FBI) who were trying to establish relationships with private sector computer companies and corporations to share information about IT security. I didn't see it is narcing, but more as "we suck, teach us to suck less". I saw them give presentations that were general security topics and trends like fraud techniques, phishing, and other general stuff. They definitely demonized hackers and did not have a grasp on what real hacking is about, but most people do not so I was not terribly offended. The private sector infragard members/supporters did not have any authority that I was aware of in terms of law enforcement of any kind. I highly doubt that has changed, but if it does, the US is in big trouble. It was information sharing only in the form of teaching how scams happens and what trends were going on in security so that they could better understand them. Sharing information is a good thing...usually.

Now that being said...I would only trust them as far as I would trust the FBI which is to say, not very far. They are ultimately a branch of the FBI and any stated mission statement or goal should be taken with a grain of salt. I am sure that those who work on the surface are probably sincere and innocent, but if they hear something that they deem as juicy , it will most certainly get elevated to the "real FBI" and the shit will hit the fan.

My advice would be to go ahead and get involved with them if you are interested, but keep them at arms reach. I would NEVER admit that I was StankDawg to any of them or at any of their events, nor would I use the "H word" around them. I suggest that you do the same. Also, please don't mention binrev to them either. If you want to take the risk for yourself and your name/site, fine, but please don't point their attention here even though we have nothing to hide. I just don't want them making stuff up for their own purposes.

As usual, always fall back to DTA (Don't Trust Anyone) unless you explicitly know them!

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Very good point Stankdawg; since I have known many of the members of this cooperative effort between the Federal Bureau of Investigation, government, and the private sector… and there fundamental mission to protect the nations critical infrastructure. Overall despite the commentary on the forums many of their events are open to civilians that can demonstrate that they have a need to know. In order to become a official member and gain the benefits of receiving early warnings, collaborate with a number of officials from the department of homeland security, department of defense, fbi, telecommunications providers, et al. You must undergo a security clearance check by the fbi, and must demonstrate that you can protect classified documents.

Also, I would have to second the warning not to mention these forums or other 'H' sites you may participate on, until you have had time to establish a mutual respect level and trust level that you feel comfortable with. I am sure Stankdawg and many of the moderators here can attest to the attention our group has gained in the past and even suffered from, because individuals that were members had posted information publically that honestly they shouldn't have. I will not mention specifically what information, but recently some members are being prosecuted for using 'Da__'s, and injuring a number of people in the process. I am sure I speak for the entire community, that we do NOT need another incident and people being slapped by the long arm of the law, simply because a young child or adult finds information that shouldn't be disclosed as is (proprietary information).

With that said, I find it funny how people tend to make and draw conclusions on organizations they do not fully understand. For example, I have had people come up to me, and make all kinds of silly and funny off the wall comments about some of the fraternity's/fratoritys that I am a member of. I generally have to take a step back and really question and think "did he/she really just say that we are some sort of conspiracy organization"...

With this new ‘age of government transparency’ that the president has taken upon himself to establish, perhaps many of the skeptics will be put at bay. BUT please understand that some INFORMATION for the safety of the country and world needs to be kept classified or secret. This is no different than your rights as an employee to not have your salary information disclosed, be reasonable protected at work, ect. Here are three letters that should hopefully help you out from the CISSP exam CIA (Confidentiality, Integrity, and Availability) http://privacy.med.miami.edu/glossary/xd_c...vailability.htm

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Um, civilian spies and snitches?

The only source of bad information about them is their own existence.

And wait a sec, the Progressive are "moonbats" because they believe in civil rights and oppose violent atrocities? Wow, some people have very "interesting" outlooks. The Progressive is the left, Alex Jones is the right.

Yeah, but both sides have more than their fair share of nutcases, and the twain often seem to gather together in communities like PrisonPlanet and Infowars.

The whole “shoot to kill” article was probably some member intoxicated at a bar that likely bumped into a reporter or it’s just some sensational new reporter clamoring for attention. One media report out of several hundred should NOT constitute facts. The fact that one person believes that he has the right to 'shoot to kill' is an outright LIE, and infragard has even put out an official press release to address this.

Yeah, that detail certainly seems like an example of irresponsible or intellectually dishonest reporting. If the reporter was really told that by an Infragard member, he ought to have questioned somebody at the FBI about that member's claim, or else named the guy in the article so he could be held accountable for his braggadocio. That Progressive article seems to walk a fine line between reporting on the program and demonizing it.

However, I can also see their point. I personally have participated in my local CAPS program whereby citizens go to meetings and interact with their district's police to discuss issues related to crime and the public welfare. Those meetings generally seemed productive, but they also had somewhat of the feel of a PR strategy. The citizens voice their concerns regarding crime and police activity, but also receive information and assurance regarding how police are dealing with various situations. This Infragard thing seems more like a "snitch network", and the idea of them leaking information to private individuals prior to notifying official authorities is kind of scary. While I can appreciate the benefit of, say, somebody in the chemical industry having a direct channel to report suspicious purchases of specific substances that could be useful for the illicit manufacture of bombs or harmful street drugs, I'm sure such protocols existed prior to Infragard. I'm not altogether comfortable with the idea of civilians being "deputized" in such a way, merely because they occupy some political standing within the local Board of Commerce or just happen to know somebody "on the inside".

Whatever happened to simply calling up the FBI and reporting suspicious activity? Their number is in the phone book. It seems highly unnecessary to involve the business community in a political way like this, and it could conceivably open the doors to some serious corruption.

My advice would be to go ahead and get involved with them if you are interested, but keep them at arms reach. I would NEVER admit that I was StankDawg to any of them or at any of their events, nor would I use the "H word" around them. I suggest that you do the same. Also, please don't mention binrev to them either. If you want to take the risk for yourself and your name/site, fine, but please don't point their attention here even though we have nothing to hide. I just don't want them making stuff up for their own purposes.

Hmmm... In that case you might want to delete this thread or else move it to a "Members Only" forum before the Google spiders pick it up!

Second thought, it's probably too late for that.

As usual, always fall back to DTA (Don't Trust Anyone) ...

Isn't the preferred nomenclature "TNO" or "TN1" ("Trust No One")?

mulder.gif

Edited by Colonel Panic
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Ah, irongeek I wasn't sure if you were referring to that article or wikipedia in general. Seriously I want to cry every time I get professional report by a graduate student or corporate executive that actively references Wikipedia. I was at a well known library the other day, and loved the fact that I could pick up a book from the early 1900's - yet the sad fact was the entire library was on the computers. :huh: Sorry I just do not get it, when did a library turn into a cyber cafe and are we training the next generation of student's to believe everything they read online or in newspapers?

ah- couldn't agree more man...

next time one will be asked about his name and they will say... wikipedia wikipedia... oh and google it of course !

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This Infragard thing seems more like a "snitch network", and the idea of them leaking information to private individuals prior to notifying official authorities is kind of scary. I'm not altogether comfortable with the idea of civilians being "deputized" in such a way, Whatever mulder.gif

well said man

yeah vigilantes - and posses

Edited by deickos
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This thread is becoming very banal in my opinion. The FBI/ Infragard has published on their website http://www.infragard.net/ exactly what their mission is, and the requirements to be an active member http://www.infragard.net/member.php?mn=2 . Furthermore, a number of their individual chapters have publically posted information on their meetings and even case studies: http://www.infragard.cincinnati.oh.us/ .

I really do not mean to sound like a jerk, but let's argue facts vs. some wacky newspaper article. Quite honestly, how would you feel if I made up a bunch of false claims attacking your company or you personally that factually were not true or correct?

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Did you even read that document you posted? Besides the part about the "shoot to kill" claim, most of what the article reported about Infragard membership is corroborated right there in the application form.

One condition of membership is "sponsorship by an existing member or partner organization". That means you must have some sort of a political connection to even qualify for membership. Like I said before, this sort of thing just opens the door for corruption. Especially in light of all the horrible things the government has recently done in the name of "fighting terrorism", I am highly suspicious of an organization like this.

Edited by Colonel Panic
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I was talking so some of the local folks, and they seem to have dropped the "sponsorship by an existing member or partner organization". I put down "Irongeek Security Site" as my company, lets see if I get in. I also wrote in the notes section that I reject Obama and StankDawg is my Führer.

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Put something in there to the effect that "100% global domination is my end goal". I'm sure they'll appreciate that.

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