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trem

Constitution: "Just a goddamned piece of paper"

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http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publ...icle_7779.shtml

Last month, Republican Congressional leaders filed into the Oval Office to meet with President George W. Bush and talk about renewing the controversial USA Patriot Act.

Several provisions of the act, passed in the shell shocked period immediately following the 9/11 terrorist attacks, caused enough anger that liberal groups like the American Civil Liberties Union had joined forces with prominent conservatives like Phyllis Schlafly and Bob Barr to oppose renewal.

GOP leaders told Bush that his hardcore push to renew the more onerous provisions of the act could further alienate conservatives still mad at the President from his botched attempt to nominate White House Counsel Harriet Miers to the Supreme Court.

"I don't give a goddamn," Bush retorted. "I'm the President and the Commander-in-Chief. Do it my way."

"Mr. President," one aide in the meeting said. "There is a valid case that the provisions in this law undermine the Constitution."

"Stop throwing the Constitution in my face," Bush screamed back. "It's just a goddamned piece of paper!"

I've heard from two White House sources who claim they heard from others present in the meeting that the President of the United States called the Constitution "a goddamned piece of paper."

The record shows the Bush Administration, the Constitution of the United States is little more than toilet paper stained from all the shit that this group of power-mad despots have dumped on the freedoms that "goddamned piece of paper" used to guarantee.

Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, while still White House counsel, wrote that the "Constitution is an outdated document."

Put aside, for a moment, political affiliation or personal beliefs. It doesn't matter if you are a Democratic, Republican or Independent. It doesn't matter if you support the invasion or Iraq or not. Despite our differences, the Constitution has stood for two centuries as the defining document of our government, the final source to determine - in the end - if something is legal or right.

Every federal official - including the President - who takes an oath of office swears to "uphold and defend" the Constitution of the United States.

Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia says he cringes when someone calls the Constitution a "living document."

""Oh, how I hate the phrase we have-a 'living document,'" Scalia says. "We now have a Constitution that means whatever we want it to mean. The Constitution is not a living organism, for Pete's sake."

As a judge, Scalia says, "I don't have to prove that it's perfect; I just have to prove that it's better than anything else."

President Bush has proposed seven amendments to the Constitution over the last five years - a record for any modern President, including a controversial amendment to define marriage as a "union between a man and woman." Members of Congress have proposed some 11,000 amendments over the last decade, ranging from repeal of the right to bear arms to a Constitutional ban on abortion.

Scalia says the danger of tinkering with the Constitution comes from a loss of rights.

"We can take away rights just as we can grant new ones," Scalia warns. "Don't think that it's a one-way street."

And don't buy the White House hype that the USA Patriot Act is a necessary tool to fight terrorism. It is a dangerous law that infringes on the rights of every American citizen and, as one brave aide told President Bush, something that undermines the Constitution of the United States.

But why should Bush care? After all, the Constitution is just "a goddamned piece of paper."

:cuss:

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capitolhillblue :lol:

but i would love to see this from a slightly more bipartisan prospective, because if its true, this is major news

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Wow, this nearly year old report is new to people?

Well, here's the new news of within the last two days -- the passage of S.3930 by Senate and House, ready to be signed into law. It will allow even citizens to be declared enemy combatants for being hostile or not going along with the ideals of present leadership, be placed into a military tribunal, allow a guilty charge to be declared without a unanimous agreement, pardon any and all presidents of past war crimes and involvement in torture, throws habeas corpus right out the window, not allow individuals involved in tribunals to invoke the Geneva Convention, will allow for secret evidence to which the defendant does not even have access to defend himself, and so much more. Don't believe me? Read it for yourself (as I have) at thomas.loc.gov. Presently it can be found here: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c109:S.+3930: but those links are usually temporary so you may have to do some searching. And here is some analysis on it as well.

Edited by ozlo
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In all seriousness, I say give it three years. Within that time you will probably see someone attempt a redress of grievances or possibly an activist type protest that ends in disaster. I don't mean the cops shooting an anarchist with a beanbag type disaster, I mean people, _us_, being held as an enemy combatant. Even more dangerous than 3930 (bear with me here) is 6166 Here are some words that plainly state this is not aimed at "foreign terrorists" whatsoever. It is for YOU.

Subchapter 7 Section 950v Subsection 27

"Any person subject to this chapter who with intent or reason to believe that it is to be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign power, collects or attempts to collect information by clandestine means or while acting under false pretenses, for the purpose of conveying such information to an enemy of the United States, or one of the co-belligerents of the enemy, shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct."

Subchapter 7 Subsection 26 of section 950v. of HR 6166

"Any person subject to this chapter who, in breach of an allegiance or duty to the United States, knowingly and intentionally aids an enemy of the United States, or one of the co-belligerents of the enemy, shall be punished as a military commission under this chapter may direct."

On the face of it, it is easy to go "Good. No quarter to the enemy." I will admit, that is my knee jerk reaction. Only when you look at it critically does it hit you.

The enemy, by very nature of being an enemy and foreign national holds no allegiance to the United States to begin with. How can he "breach of an allegiance or duty to the United States". The answer once put that way is obvious. He can't, but you can.

Should you do so, you should be shot. Problem is, you shouldn't be shot or detained indefintely without due process. I at first thought that SCOTUS would bitch slap this thing down. It may prove harder than that though. Seems safeguards against that were built in as well. It's possible this is beyond "fixing".

Excuse us for thinking we should at least get the same treatment as Aldrich Ames were we ever accused.

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Wow. Just wow. All of this is extremely disturbing. It seems that every day I'm beginning to wonder even more and more how long it'll be before all hell breaks loose throughout this country.

EDIT: http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2006/10/01/18317047.php

If all hell breaks loose your tax dollars will be paying to fly my ass back to Mexico. ;)

EDIT: Meaning I **lost** my papers.

Edited by Replica
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Wow. Just wow. All of this is extremely disturbing. It seems that every day I'm beginning to wonder even more and more how long it'll be before all hell breaks loose throughout this country.

EDIT: http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2006/10/01/18317047.php

All hell will break loose when the next "terrorist act" occurs- they will try to take peoples guns.(they did it in NO after katrina)

As Heston said to Gore:You can take my gun 'From My Cold, Dead Hands'.

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In all seriousness, I say give it three years. Within that time you will probably see someone attempt a redress of grievances or possibly an activist type protest that ends in disaster. I don't mean the cops shooting an anarchist with a beanbag type disaster, I mean people, _us_, being held as an enemy combatant. Even more dangerous than 3930 (bear with me here) is 6166 Here are some words that plainly state this is not aimed at "foreign terrorists" whatsoever. It is for YOU.

Bush gets off in 2009, and in three years, it is 2008. If something like this happens again, we should just start a protest.

I can't find out what it takes to remove a president, or to elect a presedent before this one has had their time.

Wow. Just wow. All of this is extremely disturbing. It seems that every day I'm beginning to wonder even more and more how long it'll be before all hell breaks loose throughout this country.

Well, in 20 years, how will we fead everyone in this country? THis counrty is basically heading in the wrong direction. We need one of those tax benifites on children like china has.

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Bush gets off in 2009, and in three years, it is 2008. If something like this happens again, we should just start a protest.

I can't find out what it takes to remove a president, or to elect a presedent before this one has had their time.

The avenue of protest has not been exhausted ... yet. Good thinking.

The second part you are talking about would be called an articles of impeachment, then later a vote on impeachment in the House. Then the actual trial in the Senate. Recall votes are more rare, and I am unsure if it is even possible in the case of the presidential office.

Well, in 20 years, how will we fead everyone in this country? THis counrty is basically heading in the wrong direction. We need one of those tax benifites on children like china has.

There already is a per child tax credit ... $1000 per child. Be sure to try and analyze what you hear about taxation and the "wealthy". Most people consider wealthy anyone who makes more than them, and really, only the weathy pay taxes anyway. Being not weathy, I pay almost very little tax between my refund, the Earned Income Tax Credit and the CTC. Many people make money, in a type of welfare.

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The avenue of protest has not been exhausted ... yet. Good thinking.

The second part you are talking about would be called an articles of impeachment, then later a vote on impeachment in the House. Then the actual trial in the Senate. Recall votes are more rare, and I am unsure if it is even possible in the case of the presidential office.

Oct. 5th - World can't wait protest.

Sorry its of such short notice.

worldcantwait.net

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I agree with Bush, The Constitution is "just a goddamned piece of paper". I mean come on, who needs laws? While were at it, we should throw away the Geneva Convention too. "No prisoner should be subject to cruel and unusual punishment". How vague is that?

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I saw this, but a google news search only brought up very one-sided articles. Therefor I'm faced to ignore this, no matter how much I hate Bush. Convenient timing as well, don't you think?

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I saw this, but a google news search only brought up very one-sided articles. Therefor I'm faced to ignore this, no matter how much I hate Bush. Convenient timing as well, don't you think?

Not sure which "this" you meant, since there are two topics in one here kind of. the Title topic is old, like a year old I think, and it wasn't said for sure. All sources of the story or rumor point back to the very same source, a writer by the name of Doug Thompson. As for the second topic that I elaborated on, you can read the actual bill yourself, or take the info I posted at face value. The text was plucked straight from the bill.

As for convenient timing, it isn't a story that regained legs somehow in the MSM or any outlet actually, it just happened to hit front page digg and reddit, since some people may have missed it and it has an OMBBUSHSAID THAT factor to it for people to be surprised by.

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The avenue of protest has not been exhausted ... yet. Good thinking.

The second part you are talking about would be called an articles of impeachment, then later a vote on impeachment in the House. Then the actual trial in the Senate. Recall votes are more rare, and I am unsure if it is even possible in the case of the presidential office.

Oct. 5th - World can't wait protest.

Sorry its of such short notice.

worldcantwait.net

Soryy for the thread dig. I remembered this post when I just saw this hilarious page. Looks like that protest was a great place for laughs.

There were lots of great pics in this NSFW link, naked hippies, anarchists etc. There were only one two that contained a couple people I would like to pound on. Namely the terrorist sympathizers. Protest against US policy, for the good of the USA is one thing. Carrying a sign saying "I love NY even more without the WTC" is grounds for an ass kicking.

Again, NSFW hippie titties ahead. Not a pretty sight either. Don't go here hoping to spank it, unless you like fat lesbians and nude 60 year olds.

http://zombietime.com/hall_of_shame/

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Jayzuss....

Why is it always the nasty ones who decide to go topless?

Cause they are the most desperate.

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