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Telnet and arpanet and E class addresses


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#1 D13815C

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 10:27 AM

Hello world!

I'm on a fact finding mission! I'm looking for information as small and as large as anyone can give if they have the time. I have an insatiable appetite for knowledge on this subject and basic web searches don't give enough information for my needs. If you've made it this far thanks.

This is what I want to find information about.

I want to know if anyone there are any known (and maybe not meant to be known) experimental E class IP addresses that can be accessed via a web browser and if not what application would be needed to connect to the site.

I'm looking for a list of Telnet sites that are currently active containing more than just trivial information or games. If you get my meaning. I'm looking for not usually accessed data that still might be available, including old Telnets sites that may be active but abandoned.

This gets me down to the last thing I'm trying to find out about... Is arpanet telnet still active? and how could one access it, also are there other Internet sites, telnet sites anything that can give more information about how it was planned. implemented. The science behind it so to speak. I'd dearly love original manual scripts, txt files what ever!

I understand not everyones going to be interested in old tech and it's formation and it's change to implementation in IPv4. But if there's anyone on here that likes divulging information please feel free to write comments here or PM me to get into contact. If you ahve information that would be to sensitive to be on a server i (might, i haven't tried the program yet) have a means to connect to you silently to discuss matters. well relatively unless someones already listening in on your network :p

You simply set a port to receive (sniff) packages on, and another
port to send the packages to. The respondent user sets your
send port as he's receive port and vice versa. Doing like that
makes it possible to be sociable in an effictive way without
using any servers or such.

Thank you for your time!

Sc0urgeTR

#2 wwwd40

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 10:39 AM

Oh my days! is this a troll?

#3 D13815C

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 10:44 AM

Oh my days! is this a troll?


Not at all :) I'm doing some personal research and I've reached a road block.

#4 D13815C

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 11:01 AM

Just to make things clear. I'm looking for information I'm not wanting to hack any networks and destroy or steal data. Any information that would lead to such acts wont be accessed but more sensitive data is of interest to give a clearer picture of original uses for telnet and IPv4 e class addresses.

#5 tekio

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 11:04 AM


Oh my days! is this a troll?


Not at all :) I'm doing some personal research and I've reached a road block.

Wikipedia; What is an RFC?
RFC 878; Arpanet Hots Access Protocol
RFC 854; Telnet Protocol Specification
RFC 5735; Special Use IPv4 Address Space

RFC's document the idea, and progression of a protocol, or standard for use on the Internet. Might want to throw some ketchup on those, they tend to be rather dry reading material. Have fun!

#6 wwwd40

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 11:18 AM

My bad, just read like a troll post (post demonstrates understanding but slightly skewed plus is a scatter gun of questions). Picking one topic..

Class E addresses are not going to be allowed by your local TCP/IP stack or routed by your (or any other) ISP for internet purposes - in fact any ISP worth their salt will blackhole this traffic at ingress.

If you try to ping the address it should tell you that the address is invalid and I dont think you'll be able to add a static route either.

Oh I just saw.. Looks like Tekio has some light reading for you ;-)

#7 D13815C

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 10:08 PM

My bad, just read like a troll post (post demonstrates understanding but slightly skewed plus is a scatter gun of questions). Picking one topic..

Class E addresses are not going to be allowed by your local TCP/IP stack or routed by your (or any other) ISP for internet purposes - in fact any ISP worth their salt will blackhole this traffic at ingress.

If you try to ping the address it should tell you that the address is invalid and I dont think you'll be able to add a static route either.

Oh I just saw.. Looks like Tekio has some light reading for you ;-)



Yeah I had thought that maybe class E didn't even use a normal stack. I did find an article on a class E router made by HP (unusual for such a unimaginative company to have i thought)

The scatter gun effect is because I hadn't actually ever used telnet and i had heard of one guy supposedly being the first guy to use the internet via arpanet on these forums which got me thinking about the more secretive side of Telnet and IPv4. i.e. government studies into the formation of the Internet and E class addresses.

#8 D13815C

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 10:41 PM



Oh my days! is this a troll?


Not at all :) I'm doing some personal research and I've reached a road block.

Wikipedia; What is an RFC?
RFC 878; Arpanet Hots Access Protocol
RFC 854; Telnet Protocol Specification
RFC 5735; Special Use IPv4 Address Space

RFC's document the idea, and progression of a protocol, or standard for use on the Internet. Might want to throw some ketchup on those, they tend to be rather dry reading material. Have fun!



From what I can understand in here... E class address schemes obsolete and may not be really be being used for study or what ever they did with them?

Oh and thanks for the RFC's :)

#9 tekio

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Posted 11 June 2011 - 12:08 AM




Oh my days! is this a troll?


Not at all :) I'm doing some personal research and I've reached a road block.

Wikipedia; What is an RFC?
RFC 878; Arpanet Hots Access Protocol
RFC 854; Telnet Protocol Specification
RFC 5735; Special Use IPv4 Address Space

RFC's document the idea, and progression of a protocol, or standard for use on the Internet. Might want to throw some ketchup on those, they tend to be rather dry reading material. Have fun!



From what I can understand in here... E class address schemes obsolete and may not be really be being used for study or what ever they did with them?

Oh and thanks for the RFC's :)

Class E addresses were reserved for future use, or experimentation. I read the RFC really quick, and it went over something like the class E addresses shouldn't be used on IP networks. IP is used to communicate between hosts on remote networks, subnets, or broadcast domains. So, if you set up machines on the same subnet, the class E address might, or might not work. However, most equipment that routes traffic between different networks probably will not be designed to relay traffic destined for a class E address on a remote network.

Even if networking equipment were designed to route class e addresses, they have not been assigned to anybody by a regional allocation registry. If you really want to learn how class e addresses work just play around with them. Get two hosts and assign them a class e address, and see if they can communicate with different operating systems and network utilities. Test it out to see what happens if class e addresses are used to communicate between different subnets... Some operating systems or network utilities might do unexpected things because they were not designed with class e addresses in mind. Who knows, maybe you'll stumble on to something cool.

#10 D13815C

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Posted 11 June 2011 - 08:46 AM

i don't know a lot but i think i've worked out you need different hardware to route E class IP's. Basically because it doesn't seem to have a standard for protocols. So I assume you either would have to make your own or perhaps the software that comes with the hardware defines some protocols. I need to get my hands on a couple of E class routers I think. But to be honest I know how they would work I'm really more interested in what experimentation was it used for. Is it just to experiment with different stack controls and settings for example TCP flow and how to make things run better or was it assigned for researching that can't be accessed in the public domain. Experimental and future use is very vague. I'm trying to find something solid that details what it's actually been or being used for.

But there was a part of the RFC that sounded like E class addresses are obsolete. So I assume IPv6 has some experimental addresses or something now. Or perhaps a completely different networking scheme we haven't even heard of. It's speculation I know, Which is why I'm asking if anyone actually KNOWS whats been going on with it.

#11 tekio

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Posted 11 June 2011 - 09:41 AM

i don't know a lot but i think i've worked out you need different hardware to route E class IP's. Basically because it doesn't seem to have a standard for protocols. So I assume you either would have to make your own or perhaps the software that comes with the hardware defines some protocols. I need to get my hands on a couple of E class routers I think. But to be honest I know how they would work I'm really more interested in what experimentation was it used for. Is it just to experiment with different stack controls and settings for example TCP flow and how to make things run better or was it assigned for researching that can't be accessed in the public domain. Experimental and future use is very vague. I'm trying to find something solid that details what it's actually been or being used for.

But there was a part of the RFC that sounded like E class addresses are obsolete. So I assume IPv6 has some experimental addresses or something now. Or perhaps a completely different networking scheme we haven't even heard of. It's speculation I know, Which is why I'm asking if anyone actually KNOWS whats been going on with it.

It is the software that dictates what IP addresses are valid. Do a little research on the OSI model, and where TCP/IP falls within the model. IP, what we're talking about here, is at the Network Layer. It defines communication rules between remote networks/hosts. Hardware requirements are not defined in IP. Each layer is a separate entity from the lower layers. So, no matter what hardware, or operating system is being used, it uses IP to communicate with remote networks.

Experimental to me is a vague generalization as well. But, it states, "class e addresses should not be used on an IP network". So, routers and some operating systems will not recognize class E addresses. Why should they? It's experimental, and has been reserved as such. For example class D addresses are used for multi-cast. Well, someone was bright enough to decide and save about 268million IP addresses for something that might be unforeseen at the time as well.

Fine and dandy, right? Well, not really. As you've probably heard there is a shortage of IPv4 IP addresses. It was proposed to use the 268 million class e addresses. However, with all the work it would take, patching the tcp/ip stack of current operating systems, for a short term fix, rolling out IPv6 was decided as the solution.

Yes, you would probably need to "make your own" software. It is experimental, and that's experimenting, right?

I honestly don't know much about IPv6, yet. I've never needed to lean about it, but will fairly soon. I'm definitely not gonna google it for you.


edit: as far as being experimental, it is used to experiment with different IP delivery methods, more than likely. For example, what if we want to test a new transport layer protocol that offers more robust services than TCP or UDP. Well, maybe we might need to do something to the IP layer to make that transport layer protocol work a little better. Maybe making the size of the IP packet larger to increase speed at the IP layer. Well, there are 268 million addresses that were reserved to experiment with.

Most all class a, b , and c addresses are in use right now. And the reserved address spaces for private IP ranges is reserved for functioning private IP networks.

Edited by tekio, 11 June 2011 - 10:16 AM.


#12 D13815C

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Posted 11 June 2011 - 10:59 PM

Hardware requirements are not defined in IP. Each layer is a separate entity from the lower layers. So, no matter what hardware, or operating system is being used, it uses IP to communicate with remote networks.


You don't know that. for normal A, B, C, D classes it follows the OSI model. E class has no predefined protocols. Therefore it doesn't obey the laws of the OSI model.

Anyway we're just speculating what it would or would not do. Neither of us know. Time for someone else to come in with some more knowledge.

Edited by D13815C, 11 June 2011 - 11:01 PM.


#13 D13815C

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Posted 11 June 2011 - 11:02 PM

I already understand IPv6 anyway.




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